International trade must be fairer to stop the Great British rip-off

Unfortunately I am working so cannot be there.

Countries currently being sued by corporations are Canada and Australia by respectively US drug and tobacco companies. There are apparently 500+ cases currently being decided sloowly – normally theses cases are aginst small countries but for half a billion dollars why not have a pop. It may intimidate legislators in the future. A win win for the international corporations.

Against this background you do wonder how Which? manages to say it is broadly in support of TTIP. Who in Which? makes this call?

” Longer term, we’re supporting an ambitious free trade agreement between the EU and US, which could cut all import duties on products from the US.”

I am still concerned as to the “We’re supporting” as I would like to know where the subscribers to Which?, or the shareholders of the Consumers’ Association even, have been included in this decision. Or is it simply the Which Ltd Board ? Or possibly the senior team of Which?

I have seen no poll, no campaign to explain TTIP ramifications, nothing in the Connect surveys, nothing in the magazine. BEUC the European body for Consumer organisations has been much more outspoken on the TTIP negotiations and the difference between its stance and what we are hearing in the UK from Which? is disconcerting.

” The ongoing Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership (TTIP) negotiations are being conducted behind closed doors, with the public having no way of knowing what is at stake aside from officials’ statements.
When it comes to informing citizens on the issues being negotiated within TTIP, the European Commission as our official negotiator, has a monopoly on the words. Crucially, it is the accuracy of these words which will frame people’s perception of what is still a distant outcome and define the legitimacy of the negotiations.
This reality is the reason which led to two civil society organisations – BEUC and Friends of the Earth Europe – to question the way in which the Commission uses figures in their Economic Impact Assessment of TTIP.
In a letter addressed to Commissioner for Trade, Karel De Gucht, we have underlined the importance of language as a means to mould and too often mislead public opinion on issues related to TTIP.
Both organisations stress that the Commission is projecting an overly positive economic outcome and hushes the grimmer economic scenarios…………”
http://www.beuc.eu/blog/the-european-commission-the-importance-of-unbiased-communication-on-ttip/

Hello Desiel, thanks for your comment. Which? campaigns and policy positions are determined by a number of different factors. We hear directly from our members and supporters about the issues that concern them. And, as a registered charity with a mission for all consumers, we also undertake market research and analysis to understand the challenges that all consumers face. We also have a team of policy experts who research each issue to determine our position. As such, we don’t test all our policy issues directly with our members through the magazine or Which? Connect, but any views we do get, such as right here on this Convo, help us shape them. Thanks to you and others for letting us know how you feel about this issue – we’re taking it all on board.

Thank you Patrick for that answer.

I am glad that there are policy experts as with a substantial number of Which? Directors /Trustees being retired from careers with, or employed by, Unilever and Proctor & Gamble two of the world’s largest conglomerates it may have seemed inappropriate for them to be supporting what for many is seen as a treaty that benefits multi-nationals.

However regarding the policy experts the pan-European BEUC representing most of the major consumer organisations of the EU is complaining that there is no visibility of what is being negotaited but the experts advising Which? are able to give a qualified view in favour.

As to be expected with over 500,000 thoughtful Which?readers could these experts reasoning be shared with us. I assume the policy papers cannot hold any secrets.

Hi Jim, thanks for your comment of concern. We’re still very much a full member of Beuc, but we’re currently between reps. As soon as the new rep is confirmed we’ll make sure to get it updated on that page. In the meantime, you can see our full member page on Beuc’s website here: http://www.beuc.eu/beuc-network/members/which Thanks.

Just as a point of information it is 1.4m subscriptions rather than 1.4 unique subscribers. I used to have three subscriptions and now only have two. The actualt total of Which? subscribers I believe is somewhat south of 1 million and my guess is around 620,000 for the magazine and that includes 250,000 as on-line subscribers.

Does that include postage and import duties? If not it is hardly a fair comparison.

Bosch I imagine sell at a lower price in the USA because they have to in order to compete with De Walt etc. I guess its rather like charging English plumber prices in India – you charge what the local market can bear if you want to get any business.

I do wonder if the GTS 310 is made in China and the GTS 10 in Germany and they use different quality components.

One problem with TTIP is that disputes between, say, US corporations and the UK Government might be decided by extra-territorial tribunals run by lawyers who are accountable to nobody. We know what bullying tactics and commercial pressures can be exerted by large corporations; I don’t want to see contracts and privatisations being forcibly awarded because of fear of us being ineffective in defending our national interest against such people.

There may be benefits to TTIP but we need to discard the disbenefits. The EU recognises this; why does not our own Business and Innovatinons Dept? We appear to have handed responsibility for negotiating it to someone who, it is said, is keen on big corporations suing governments as ameans of expanding business. In the public interest?

I think the matter is slightly murky as there is apparently no policy paper available and the support seems to be derived from a speech by our CEO. Which? kindly provided a link for me. The speech had caveats about ISDS but the fact remains is that pverall the CEO has given the impression that Which? is in support.

As I have said previously the BEUC site – Beuc representing the consumer associations of Europe – is far far less sanguine. The benefit figures that are publicly voiced in the negotiations are seen to be suspect so the whole case is suspect particularly as of course the negotiations are highly secret.
http://www.beuc.eu/press-media/news-events/how-improve-transparency-ttip-negotiations

It may be true to say that some regions may suffer more than others within the EU which provides another complication in the process.

However I think it unwise to resign if you are an Ordinary Member of the Consumer Organisation as the AGM is only weeks away on Monday 19th November. If you can attend do so. If you have lost your proxy form sent at the beginning of August the Electoral ReformService will provide another. AGM’s generally are fairly restrictive but voting against the standard resolutions is a traditional way to say you are unhappy.

If you google “wikia consumers association” you may find more.

What worries me Matt is what deals HMG will do with the USA which involve usurping the right of British citizens to determine who gets contracts in local government as the USA wants BIg Business to be able to sue your local council if they give it to a BRITISH company regardless of who puts in tenders . This is a basic law of this country another country can and will overule the wishes of the voters in a democratically elected council . For those disagreeing which one of you is going to FORCE “the Donald ” to overrule the American Bill of Rights and the Declaration of Independence , never happen !!. Thats what was hidden from the British public for a long time by secret conferences in various countries – well are we just a satrap of the USA ?