The Lobby: Off-topic discussion

Hello and welcome to The Lobby! Your place to discuss subjects that just don’t fit in our other conversations. Make yourself at home!

Do you want to discuss an issue but can’t find the right place to post it? Or maybe you’re looking for somewhere to chat with your community pals? Well, you’ve come to the right place…

As with any community or conversation it can – and does – wander off-topic. This is perfectly natural, but it hasn’t always been possible to do so on some of our posts because of the precisely defined nature of each subject.

So, at the behest of some of our community members, we created this off-topic discussion area – The Lobby.

Any ideas spawned here in The Lobby could generate new posts for debate and discussion on Which? Conversation, so you – our community members – are able to help shape the direction of our community.

What happened to the original Lobby?

Why do we have two Lobbies? Well, like all good franchises, we wanted to experiment with a sequel. But seriously, the original Lobby was so popular (with almost 13,000 comments), it was becoming hard to load the page.

So we’re starting fresh with what we’re affectionately calling “The Lobby 2”.

No comments from first Lobby have been deleted, and you can still link to comments, but you won’t be able to add new comments.


To ensure The Lobby remains a healthy and friendly place for you all to share your thoughts, musings all of our Community Guidelines apply, with the exception of one:

You may go off-topic… that is the purpose of The Lobby.  🙂

Looking for other areas to talk?

• Website feedback: Let us know about any technical issues, and share your ideas on the future of Which? Conversation closure: A discussion about the closure of

Which? Members: Discuss issues related to our organisation, including governance

Welcome to the Lobby!

So without further ado… welcome! What are you waiting for!?


As religion was mentioned (not just by me ) here is a piece of “religious ” news from Scotland .

As you know the FM has imposed near “Draconian ” measures to cut down on alcoholism in Scotland but she is “fuming ” /not a happy bunny at one drink the Scots love mainly Buckfast “wine ” which has avoided the increased charges .

Buckfast sales have sky rocketed in the six months since the Scottish Government introduced a minimum price on alcohol.
Buckfast monks are raking in the cash after sales of the tonic wine have soared following a crackdown on minimum pricing for alcohol.
A total of £36.5million was spent on Buckfast in only 24 weeks, following Minimum Unit Pricing being introduced at the start of May – £5.3million more than the same period last year.
That is the equivalent of 3,630 extra bottles a day of the 15 per cent ABV drink, made at Buckfast Abbey in Devon.

Have a read of-
I tried checking up the share prices on the NYSE but God wasn’t listed .
Looking forward to seeing a special Scottish edition label as a “thank you ” with the Mac”Grogery tartan on it.


The Scots should take care. You can only sup the juice of one year’s crop once and at this rate the stock level will dwindle forcing up the price. Whether the monks can increase production in time for next year’s harvest will be interesting, and the question will then be whether the boom in consumption will be sustained until the wine is ready to drink.

When you searched the stock markets for share price changes you should have been looking for J. Chandler & Co [as the paper reported, the makers of Buckfast tonic wine] instead of looking for God [many people make the same mistake].


Welcome to World Orphans Day, the day in 1927 when Leon Trotsky was expelled from the Soviet Communist Party, paving the way for Joseph Stalin and the day in 1968 when the US Supreme Court declare Arkansas law banning teaching evolution in public schools to be unconstitutional.

Beans on toast


Lite: the new way to spell “Light,” now with 20% fewer letters!


It’s not that I’m afraid to die, I just don’t want to be there when it happens.


Ever stop to think, and forget to start again?

Patrick Taylor says:
12 November 2018

Which? November 2018

“If you’re viewing a flat…
Is it leasehold or freehold?”

Now let us see do they mention it when buying a house …. No. That is OK then as we know that leasehold houses are not a problem. Or do we know that ?

BTW freehold flats are very very uncommon unless it is in a two or three flat old dwelling when it is possible the ground floor flat would have it. They can carry onerous terms on upkeep and I would say more but it is a complex subject in operation even if the legal side is straightforward

Patrick Taylor says:
12 November 2018

Kwikfit have quite a record of problems for customers and I wondered what Which? had to say over the years about a company’s staff going rogue. See the BBC from item from 2011 – particularly note the comments; followed by an undated BBC hosted description of the programme and response. which seems to date from 2013.

A search of Which? brings this
No results for “Kwikfit”

Seems to me that adopting the Consumentenbonds way of working with consumer complaints could very usefully be brought to Which? for it seems to suffer a blindness to consumer problems or naming companies.

How it works in Holland where there is a complaint process ..
“Complaint Kwik-Fit: APK approval rejection criteria Mercury Fit

Complaint number
# 188328
Lion’s Wout
2016-10-03T12: 13Z

“The complaint
On 26-9-2016 APK inspection at Kwik-Fit Brielselaan Rotterdam. The car was rejected at a multitude of points, such as brake pads (would be metal on metal), dust cover steering, lamps of the license plate, and not (well) closing trunk lid and one were made comments about the CO2 measurement that just within the borders.
Furthermore, some oil spills were found but no disapproval was reported.
Five days later I had the car checked again at the points of Kwik Fit by a recognized Bovag company with the assignment to re-execute the inspection, and in particular to restore the laundry list to items that were there.
The car was immediately approved for 60 Euro, incl. MOT, after a few small interventions.
Replace bulbs with direction indicators and license plate and brake pads.
The dust covers were okay, the trunk closed after a little oil,
The assignment for the repairs by Kwik-Fit turned out to be 450.00 euros. Bugging is called that.
The solution
Take complaint very seriously because this smells like swindling. Particularly making the inspection official and rejecting the car in the register was a coercive that we are not waiting for. ”


I stopped using them after they scratched my alloy wheels during a tyre change.


Welcome to Purple Day, the day in 1789 when Ben Franklin wrote”Nothing . . . certain but death & taxes” and day in 1980 on which Voyager 1 sent back the first close-up pictures of Saturn.


70% of our planet is covered in water. The other 30% is covered in idiots.


Can’t see an end. I have no control and I don’t think there’s an escape. I don’t even have a home anymore. Think it’s time for a new keyboard


Error, no keyboard. Press F1 to continue.

DerekP says:
13 November 2018

That was one of my all time favourite IBM PC bios error messages 😀


We noticed this scam just now involving some major US brands such as Target and The Bodyshop (US) having their Twitter accounts hacked.

Here’s how it appears to work: the scammers hack multiple verified Twitter accounts with large amounts of followers; next post a tweet saying they’re giving away vast amounts of money through bitcoin; then the scam part, they say in order to claim some of this bitcoin you just need to send a small amount to the account’s ‘wallet’.

The scam plays off of the ‘official’ and verified status of twitter accounts. Should Twitter be doing more to ensure the security of Twitter accounts with large followings?

DerekP says:
13 November 2018

I guess Twitter should take all reasonable measures to secure its subscribers’ accounts.

But, if there are subscribers going around with passwords like “password123” then that won’t help any.

That said, scams like the one described should trigger disbelief on the basis that “it if sounds too good to be true, it’s most likely a scam”, so some of the responsibility for defensive measures also lies with the potential victims.


I am a bit confused over whose Twitter accounts have been hacked – is it [as it would seem via the link] the well-known brands with large numbers of followers so the fake messages look as though they being tweeted from there, or is it some of these brands’ followers whose Twitter accounts are being hacked because they have weak passwords?

I just knew crypto-currency would fall into disrepute and become unviable for regular purposes. It is the perfect means of exchange for the criminal. I think the general advice to the public now must be to have nothing at all to do with it and close down any approach that introduces it. It is a one-way non-negotiable trap against which there is no defence as the holder of the ‘wallet’ is completely untraceable. It’s not so much the currency that is encrypted but the identity of any fraudster offering it as a channel for transactions.


As far as “brand followers ” are concerned John ,and this is a direct quote from Twitter -quote-

Can I purchase or sell account interactions (i.e. Twitter followers, Retweets or likes) on Twitter?

No. Twitter strictly prohibits the purchasing and selling of account interactions on our platform. When you purchase followers, Retweets and likes, you are often purchasing bot (fake) or hacked accounts. Any account caught participating in this behavior will be in violation of the Twitter Rules and may be suspended.If your account is found to have purchased followers, Retweets and likes, your account may be suspended.
If your account is promoting the selling of followers, Retweets and likes, your account may be suspended.
If your account is set up with the sole purpose of selling followers, Retweets and likes, your account may be suspended.
No dubiety there .

The website was in text as I have blocked any j scrips/etc.

Have a read of this year old account of it


In this example, the official Twitter accounts of Target, The Body Shop (US) etc. have been hacked.


‘”We’re in close contact with Twitter, have deleted the tweet and have locked the account while we investigate further,” Target said in a statement, acknowledging that its account was “inappropriately accessed” for half an hour.’


Thank you for clarifying, Oscar.

It’s the brands whose Twitter accounts are vulnerable so once a hacker gets in they can attack the brands’ customers with bogus offers and Bitcoin scams. I feel that Twitter should do more to protect its personal users but clearly the companies that use Twitter as a marketing platform or who run active accounts to attract customer feedback and comments need to defend themselves a lot better against the hackers.


Duncan – it does not seem as though trading in followers is the issue here, just straightforward hacking followed up by a nasty scam. The likelihood is that the brand followers will be young, inexperienced and quite susceptible to the bogus offers purporting to come from companies to which they have an allegiance.