Update: Samsung’s too-hot-to-handle Galaxy Note 7

In case anybody thinks I am “getting at Samsung ” that is not the case , I have one of their SS commercial microwaves and I am very happy with it , but unless somebody can prove otherwise, I think it is manufactured in South Korea.

iPhone 6 components are made worldwide, largely assembled in China (hence “made in China”) from what I can find, and batteries?: Samsung in South Korea. Huizhou Desay Battery in China.”

I don’t know where the information has come from that there have been “4 million exploding batteries”.

It seems to be Samsung’s quality control that has been inadequate. Irrespective of where components are manufactured under contract, the client company remains responsible for their specification, design, performance, and safety. For such a seriously defective device to reach the market place in such volumes shows that corners were cut by the client [as well as by the battery manufacturer] in not examining every stage of production and testing comprehensively. I note [!] that Samsung’s voluntary recall process has been criticised in America and that the US Consumer Product Safety Commission has now stepped in to impose a compulsory recall in order to speed up the return of the devices and the protection of the public from the fire risk. I suggest the UK needs such a government body as recalls and safety alerts here are haphazard and Trading Standards is ineffectual.

I should have said Potentially exploding batteries malcolm and its the Galaxy Note 7 , although ,you are right its not the first case of this in earlier models.

Exactly John , they were trying to “outdo ” Apple,s Iphone 7 . They wanted a bigger battery in a slim model so upped the capacity , there was no choice but to make the separators between the anode and cathode thinner to increase capacity -professor Lee Sang-yong and that caused failure –IHS Markit Technology analyst Wayne Lam- “the issue comes from weak controls in manufacturing rather than poor or unsafe design . So we are back to manufacturing .

.duncan – sorry for the confusion. I do know its the Galaxy 7 I was pointing out that the iPhone 6 batteries (along with other components and assembly) were also made in the “land of made to a price” (although neither phone is cheap, so the price might be appropriate to normally decent quality).

One report (trusted reviews.com) says that Note 7 batteries were made 60-70% by Samsung SDI (are they in Korea?) and 30-40% by ATL China. Supplies by ATL have been upped to help meet the quantity replacements required. Which one is the land of made to a price and which one produced the defective batteries I wonder? It sounds like it may be the Samsung maufacture.

I go along with all that, Malcolm. Another case here of ‘the best’ becoming the enemy of ‘the good’ in traditional UK civil service manner.

It seems to me, though, that it is left too much to manufacturers’ discretion as to whether a product is recalled and how to announce that.

It is incredible that the tumble-dryers that burst into flames and the washing machines whose doors randomly explode have not been subject to any effective regulatory control. The Whirlpool CEO must have charmed the pants off the Select Committee because their subsequent silence has been deafening. Trading Standards’ response has been pathetic and given the company a free pass to do as little as they can get away with in their own good time. There must be at least a partial database of affected tumble-dryer owners so some proactive action should be taking place – even if they were all offered a free smoke alarm pending proper redress.

As well as manufacturers making recall or repair announcements Trading Standards and other bodies have a market surveillance responsibility to report possible defective products (RAPEX lists reports) and should ensure they are dealt with. There should be plenty of people to report problems – not least, all those who own and use them, the consumers.

Which? seems reticent at being actively involved – Whirlpool Indesit seems not to have ignited any useful action from them. I have first-hand experience of its unwillingness to engage. The Members Forum has a question from a consumer that they have not answered a week after it was asked. Product recall is a serious issue that a consumers organisation should take a lead on, in my opinion. But by action as well as words.

18/1/2011
conversation.which.co.uk/home-energy/product-recalls-increasing-but-are-they-publicised-enough/

A US consumer body sends me a daily email on all consumer snippets and recalls for free. Why cannot Which? offer the same service to subscribers?

Does Which? have access to all recall information? And what about the vast majority who are not on Which?’s email database? We need a national recall/repair notifocation system that is retailer-funded and requires compulsory registration at the time of purchase by the seller. In my opinion! 🙂

” I go along with all that, Malcolm. Another case here of ‘the best’ becoming the enemy of ‘the good’ in traditional UK civil service manner.” To quote JW.

As to does Which? have access of course it does the same as you or I. The difference is that rather than leaving it to chance subscribers could choose to be extremely well informed on these matters. and have say a weekly email

Add a few sentences about other matters and bob’s your uncle. BTW this following is what the weekly freebie from the ConsumerReports of the USA serves up.

Recently on Consumerist…

Big Data is watching: “Privacy” is the buzz of our era, but… what even is privacy — and how much control do you actually have over your private data?

Two sides to every story: Former Wells Fargo employees shared their insider views on how the bank’s high-pressure sales goals led a number of employees to fraudulently open up millions of unauthorized accounts.

What’s in your food?: Burger King, KFC, and 14 other restaurant chains are still earning “F” grades for their antibiotics policies.

Speak up: In the wake of ITT Technical Institute’s collapse, we talked to some former students about the school’s high-pressure marketing, underwhelming courses, poor job-placement, and other shady practices.

Don’t do it: AAA says we’re all wasting billions of dollars every year on premium gasoline for vehicles that don’t actually need it, and we should stop.

The problem here may partly be that in making a phone waterproof, it cannot be adequately sealed after you or I replace the battery. If this is a trade off between user-replaceable batteries and a phone you can drop down the loo, I wonder what most would prefer? Personally, I would avoid a phone that could not have the battery easily replaced. Is this the market leading the consumer, or a market responding to consumer demand?

I can’t see why high water resistance is such a strong feature of mobile phones. As soon as people realise that their device will not work after immersion they will take more care of it or accept the consequences.

Apparently, a lot of students drop their ‘phones down the loo.

They put them in the back pocket of their jeans / trousers/ shorts/etc and when they visit the closet, rotate their bodies and de-clothe, guess what falls out and where. Perhaps phones should have an attachment for a safety cord. Alternatively, put them somewhere more sensible – anything in a back pocket is vulnerable to pinching.

There is no reason why the battery compartment cannot be sealed so that the electronic circuitry of the phone is unaffected if the battery compartment is affected by water ingress.

Thanks Ian. There is clearly no limit to the advantages of a higher education.

Presumably you don’t want the battery to get wet either?
http://www.baj.or.jp/e/frombaj/03.html
“Do not spill water, salt water, juice or other fluids on a lithium-ion battery. Doing so may break the protective circuit built into the battery, resulting in the battery being charged with an abnormal current or voltage, and causing overheating, explosion or fire.”

But why do we need water-resistant phones – unless we want to take them swimming, use them in the shower, splash proof rather than IPX7 submersible might be adequate and much easier to seal.

I have been looking at a handheld marine VHF radio belonging to a friend. These are commonly used as backups to fixed sets or as the the sole radio on small craft. It is marked ‘waterproof’. Looking at the design, both the radio and the battery are sealed but no attempt has been made to seal the battery to the radio. The gold-plated contacts providing battery power to the radio are well separated, which will minimise discharge current if the radio is in salt water. If VHF radio manufacturers can make handheld sets that can be used at sea and will survive immersion in salt water, I don’t think it is too much expect smartphone manufacturers to do the same. I see that some of the current VHF handheld phones will float – a sensible feature that might mean that they could be recovered if dropped overboard.

Earlier this year I had to use my smartphone make calls to the emergency services in wet conditions. I believe that every phone on sale should be sufficiently water resistant to survive use in our wet climate, as a minimum.

Wavechange – marine vhf radio handhelds are built to a much higher standard that cell-net phones as regards protection from water, they are usually “ruggedised ” . The PCB boards are better as are the components and they are asked to do less than a smartphone and are not designed for thinness and “style ” . Please note I am talking of the high quality ones used by our emergency services NOT the rubbish on Ebay/Amazon. , they can float on water or can be submersed for long periods and still work. Those high quality ones are dear .

Protecting circuitry from moisture has a long history. Military electronic equipment used in WW2 was ‘topicalised’ to afford protection that would survive jungle humidity.

For years, phone manufacturers have been fitting detectors that show if phones have been exposed to moisture. Here, for example, is information about Apple phones etc: https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT204104

As you say, there is too much focus on thin phones and style. I would rather that the effort went into making phones waterproof and the manufacturers would not need to use liquid contact detectors.

Thanks for sharing @wavechange, Samsung has reportedly paused production of the smartphone after two reports of smoking replacement handsets in the US. The smartphone is yet to be launched in the UK.

I bet heads roll in South Korea.

Thanks Duncan, we’ll update the convo now.

Maybe all Samsung employees in the mobile phone division will be condemned to having a fully charged Note 7 kept in their coat pocket at all times.

It is a great shame to see this kind of problem on such a large scale. I hope at some time a full explanation will be forthcoming so others can learn from it. Akin to burning batteries in airliners; some things just can’t be predicted and we learn by experience.

If I was a conspiracy theorist (or John le Carre thinking up a plot) I’d wonder whether a rival mobile phone manufacturer could have sabotaged Samsung battery production in some way………… No, that wouldn’t happen in the real world…would it. 🙁

I can understand why the Royal Mail and other carriers should refuse to handle phones with a known battery fault. It’s just common sense.

Ian , Samsung has announced that the total projected loss from the demise of the Note 7 is $5.4 Billion.

Whirlpool and VW Group are facing losses too. Maybe companies have become too big.

If people want ever-cleverer products and gadgets at the prices they seem willing to pay, and in the volumes that generates, then huge investment in development, manufacture and marketing is required. Hence large companies with a large funding base (made up, of course, of large numbers of contributing owners – the shareholders – such as you, me and anyone who relies on investments to feed their pension for example).

If you travel on your overseas hols on a modern aircraft at the price you now pay, could you do that without the likes of a Boeing, Airbus for example? Would we have had affordable cars without the likes of Ford or Morris?

My passport has expired, Malcolm. I used to holiday abroad after attending conferences where the flights had been paid for by the grants and contracts that supported my research. I just paid for the additional accommodation, insurance, food, etc. All legitimate and most of it paid for by the UK and US companies that supported me. People working for these companies often did the same when they travelled. The only problem was that conferences and meetings with industrial partners were often organised in expensive places.

Do you think it’s right that senior staff of companies are paid a lot more than you and I were?

Sorry, wavechange, this is really off topic. I was commenting in reply on the need for large companies, not their pay levels. I’m lost for the connection 🙂

I always wait before installing a new OS, be that OSX or iOS. I prefer if the early adopters discover the flaws. When I did upgrade to El Capitan I was delighted with the speed increases and – most importantly – its Mail handling. Far superior to its predecessor.

It’s interesting that Americans are no longer exclusively buying US manufactured appliances. Americans have always preferred top-loaders whereas we prefer to stack our appliances.