Have you tried an Aldi or Lidl ‘special buy’ appliance?

You would imagine that a Consumers’ Association belonging to international organisations including BEUC would be able to reproduce test results from its sister organisations – like Test.de which is often praised for its approach and work. They would lose no subscribers – how many British are members of other associations? – and it would save Which? considerable money that they could spend on other worthy projects.

Aldi and Lidl have always been owned by totally different families, but Aldi is divided into Aldi Nord and Aldi Sud and the two areas are run by brothers.

HOE DO YOU GET THE GERMAN SATELLITE TV

I have bought many tools from them and currently have two types of sander , a powered scraper and some hand tools. The quality is good. The only thing I have chucked was the battery driven drill when the batteries had no power on re-charge and it was unnecessary for me to have a third drill. Currently an AEG Battery, AEG mains, and a very old Wolf.

Battery power is great but the chances of finding the right batteries in 3 or 5 years time may be slim or the cost heavy. Of course this could apply to any battery driven device so the question should be how long do you intend to keep it, and the company to supply. An area that should be of interest to consumers.

Wolf – Patrick Taylor ? I remember going for a job there at their London factory in Hanger Lane -W1 (I didnt get it ) .Remember the drills though , went on forever -Crown Approved as well , and I like AEG also.

I don’t know any brand of DIY-grade power tools where replacement batteries are available at a sensible price. The old Ni-Cd batteries tended to fail prematurely unless used fairly regularly. Lithium batteries are better, especially at holding their charge, but I don’t know how long they will last.

It would be better for the environment if manufacturers would agree on standard sizes and voltages so we could have a few sizes of rechargeable batteries that would fit different brands of power tools, cameras, etc. At present, functional equipment is scrapped when the rechargeable batteries fail. Thank goodness we have a few sizes (e.g. AA) of rechargeable batteries that can be used in a variety of small electrical goods.

That is why I still keep my mains-powered tools. Although I also use cordless drills, sanders , etc, there are sometimes long periods in between uses and I suspect the batteries will fail well before the tools have done much work. So long as spares remain available for a sensible period, even at a price, that will be helpful.

The matter of non-standard batteries and eventual need for replacement is one that consumers need to address via some action. Some of us no doubt remember all the bespoke chargers that came with mobile phones. AFAIR it was the Chinese Govt who effectively enforced standard chargers and connectors.

In our Western consumer society we have allowed a wide variety which is basically ensuring a certain obsolencence. Great for manufacturers and a poor result for consumers and, via the consequent trashing, bad for the planet.

p.s. I find I actually have another Wolf drill – a diddy one with a chuck requiring a key. I also have a Lidl SDS breaker which apart from me allowing it to bind to a blade has performed very adequately in the 5hours usage over a decade. One of those tools which for some tasks is really necessary.

It’s great that the same charger can be used for phones and many other small electrical goods but zero out of ten for whoever came up with a connector that is not reversible.

I have a cheap Wickes SDS breaker/drill that has only been used once in the past 15 or 20 years. It saved me the cost of employing someone to repair a wall. We did not have a local Aldi or Lidl when I bought it.

Phone batteries, portable tools, car batteries, all are non standardised in one way or another – size, connection for example. A case where consumers’ associations world wide could get together and lobby for standardisation. Common mechanical and electrical connection would be my starting point, keyed for different voltages and current outputs. Is it workable? It will take years, but if you never start…… The International Standards Organisation would be that starting point. However, unless these consumer groups have direct representation on such bodies their voice will not be heard. I am still trying to find out what involvement Which? has with BSI.

I recently had to junk a perfectly good Worx cordless drill, simply because the NiCads were done and replacement Li-ions were prohibitively expensive. It set me to thinking.

Across all power tools voltages are within a fairly similar range: 12 – 18v. There are also around 30 manufacturers of battery cells world wide, with increasing numbers from China. Overall, therefore, that’s not a lot of manufacturers and a comparatively small voltage range. So it might be possible for an enterprising company to manufacture re-stock battery systems – i.e. replacement batteries in their raw state with an adaptor to fit most power tools on the market. I’d imagine the same could be done for cameras. I have around six digital still cameras and three video cameras – each of which takes a different shaped battery. But the cells inside each are not very different: merely the connector. But I’m certain that the reason we have such a plethora of batteries is simply that device manufacturers want us to remain dependent on their own brand battery and have to buy more and more of them.

I bought some bypass pruners/loppers in Aldi some years ago. They were quite good to start with but soon the jaws spread at the centre bolt and I couldn’t tighten it so they were useless. Nevertheless, at the price I paid they were quite good value and might have lasted longer if I had stuck to cutting twigs.

I had forgotten about my Lidl loppers. 🙁 I could see that they were not heavily built but judged them good enough for shrubs and roses and I used them successfully for a few years. They were cheap and adequate for the intended purpose.

When I moved home I inherited some trees and the aluminium anvil on the loppers soon failed. I bought a pair of old stock Wilkinson Sword loppers that were heavily discounted and they have done a lot of work in the past year.

Did they replace it when you took it back? Or did you get a refund?

Tend to agree Ian. We have bought quite a lot of the cheap garden tools from Lidl to stock a community garden project. The pruning saw blades go blunt fairly quickly, the logging saw blades are very thin and bendy and don’t last long either – but then they are very cheap and if they’re used only occasionally maybe it’s not a problem. Saw blades do seem to be one area where paying a bit more pays dividends in sharpness and longevity. I didn’t like the feel of the loppers, bit heavy and cumbersome, so while we have a couple for the project I haven’t bought them for use at home. I did buy the Lidl lawn scarifier/aerator for home use and that has been OK for the previous 2 seasons. I don’t know how good it is compared to a branded version, but at around £30 it does the job for us. The only real problem with it is the collecting bag is very small and fills up after only a few yards of lawn.

I had a similar need for a small table to put my printer on. I found one I had made earlier – in third form woodwork to be exact [1961], complete with loose mortise joints and a damaged plywood top. It had been in the garden shed for years with stuff stacked on it but I refettled it, painted it, and it is now doing sterling service next to my desk with a new undershelf for storing replacement cartridges. Probably cost me more than £6.99 though. The stuff in the shed is now perched on top of some apple crates.

David I have the standard instructions for use of one of those charger/Jump Starters. Jump Starters are actually portable 12V DC supplies using a compact (small ) internal battery and MUST be charged for up to 36 hours , there should be an indicator letting you know if it needs charged. As they depend on that battery they must be kept in a charged state with regular charging . If the unit is only a Jump Starter then it must not be used as a car battery charger as its current output is nowhere near enough to charge a car battery. As your is dual use then the internal battery hasn’t been charged to full capacity to allow enough instant current to start the car.

Thank you Duncan. What you say makes sense but there is nothing in my instructions about an internal battery nor is there an indicator on the charger for this. Although, if it does have an internal battery, it could explain why it’s so surprisingly heavy.

Thanks for having the courtesy to reply David , many dont and it gets a bit discouraging. The whole purpose of your jump starter is to start a car with a flat battery, not providing an indicator(costing buttons to fit-(led+resistor ) puts in doubt the state of “German engineering ” its a basic part of a jump starter.

Duncan is referring to a power pack with an internal battery and heavy cables. Traditionally these contained a lead acid battery that must be kept fully charged to prevent deterioration, but smaller and lighter models with rechargeable lithium batteries are becoming more common.

The alternative is a starter/charger (without an internal battery), which has one or more charge settings plus a higher current ‘start’ setting for brief use. The type sold for DIY use does not provide enough power to start the engine, so the battery must be charged for a short period before attempting to start the engine. Mine does not have warning lights, though there is a meter to show the charge rate. I suspect that this is the type that David has and the reason it is heavy is that it contains a large transformer.

I think you may be right, wavechange. Looking through the ventilation slots there is a large iron armature that could be a transformer although, when it’s on, it sounds like an electric motor running. Either way, it still doesn’t work! And I’ve tried every possible way I could think of to use it (and that’s two chargers on two different cars).

Encontre Wavechange I was referring to the modern small “jump -starters containing -a VERY small battery , I especially went to a US electronic supply company that supplies them for US car drivers . I know all about the old original -large battery jump-starters used by garages , no this plugs into the power point on a car . As this unit is very portable it can be kept in the boot , the latest Lithium 12V DC STARTER battery based on UltraPhosphate ( trade mark ) technology for micro hybrid vehicle applications delivering “outstanding” cold cranking /60 % lighter than normal car battery . The company advertising it gives data of = 900A cold cranking / about 28 CM long ways.

David – The hum is caused by a mains transformer with a laminated iron core – simple and reliable. If you have waited a few minutes before attempting to start the car, it seems like it is faulty. You can prove the point by seeing if the battery charger will light a spare car bulb. Hopefully Lidl will give you a refund.

Duncan – My power pack has a 12V 40Ah battery which I have used to jump start a 4 litre diesel engine. I think the small lithium ones that you refer to must work by partially recharging the vehicle battery, in the same way that a starter/charger does. Apart from being lighter and smaller than power packs based on lead-acid batteries, the lithium battery will not be damaged if not recharged promptly.

I had the same problem with a Wall Clock purchased for our church belfry for which Lidl received many complaints and comments but if one is clever, carefully remove the works or glass and physically move the hour hand one hour to English time, problem solved.

I like your simple and practical solution, David.

The same standards will continue to apply.

Malcolm r.
Will they?

Yes they will, Sandy. It will be essential to maintain existing standards and not remove or lower them if we are to be able to compete with European manufacturers and trade around the world. Many British Standards are superior to other international standards. I dispute that low price UK-manufactured goods are worse than low price imported goods. Are Nissan and Toyota cars inferior in quality to equivalent French or Italian ones?

In the context of appliances and household articles on spot sale in Aldi and Lidl stores, the picture emerging through this Conversation is mixed; there are some good quality items as well as some bad ones. Both stores have a good reputation for refunding or substituting in the case of recently-purchased defective products but many just wear out prematurely; other major retailers have similar policies but possibly less need to exercise them so evidence is not forthcoming.

Currently most British Standards are simply the implementation of international standards – usually Euro Norms. Hence they are numbered BS EN ######. This arose from the harmonisation of standards so we all work on the same basis. This allows us to trade – sell products and services – with other countries without having to assess products against individual countries standards with their own peculiarities, as used to be the case.

You have to be careful when you introduce “quality” into standards. Many standards lay down the minimum safety that products, for example, must achieve. Quality, in the standards sense, then means ensuring that those minimum standards continue to be maintained. This involves assessing producers systems, from design and development, production, to after sales to ensure that the production continues to produce products consistently that will meet the safety standards (and performance where that is a standards issue).

So, for the UK to sell to other countries will require us to adhere to existing and updated standards.

I agree with you David. Aldi and Lidl seem to be able to offer reasonable products at good prices which overall represents very good value for money. In this instance, being largely unbranded can be an advantage because it does not raise unrealistic expectations.

I agree that this would help establish the credibility of vendors offering what seem to be bargains. I am a bit of a believer in getting what you pay for – at least at the bottom end. If something is particularly cheap against its competitors then there may be a reason; cheap components, poor manufacture and materials, very basic features. Not all bad, and some may just want this. I’ve an electric chop saw that cost £20 bought for a particular job that did not demand great accuracy; I would not (could not) use it for decent joinery but it worked.

You can learn a lot (Which?) by simply taking a product to bits and looking at the construction and components – quality of motor, bearings, robustness, for example. It is not always necessary to do full testing to get a good idea as to how good or bad a product might be.

I had a look at the steam generator after having just bought a Philips replacement. The constant steam output was only 40 gm. Very low. I would be interested to know how it stands up to review.

As an alternative to a steam iron you could iron clothes etc. straight from the washing machine. I started doing this when I had extremely hard water and the steam iron had to be descaled regularly. I would never go back to using a steam iron.

Charles as Aldi is a German company a lot of its products originate from there but either way could you name the commercial manufacturer and the model of the scarifier ? It doesn’t matter about the price its the principle that counts .

Sorry Duncan on appliances that is an incorrect assumption to make, they are not most often German at all. Not even slightly.

Spares and accessory support is something from abysmal to non-existent and I know, I get asked for parts for the stuff they’ve sold all the time. Virtually all of it has zero support.

Cheap, nasty, throwaway gear.

K.

I will differ from you Kenneth I purchased several pieces of computer equipment which at the time were made in Germany , one was a HDD and had no problems with them . If you want to see cheap+nasty just look a Morrison,s equipment for the kitchen cheap nasty Chinese rubbish, I went through three tin openers in a short time due entirely to the sprocket that engages the tin being made of soft metal and metal I know about worked with it for many years in heavy industry , case hardened it annealed it , sawed it bore it , filed it , made engineering parts by hand for machine tools , the same applies to many other supermarkets importing from the Land of Built to a Price .

Computer equipment maybe, don’t know a thing about what Lidl or Aldi sell in that regard.

Appliances, I do.

K.

I remember the name now Kenneth its Medion , and yes its a German manufacturing company , I have just checked it out to see if its been taken over by a foreign company , doesn’t look like it . Its got branches worldwide.

I think Medion is a genuine manufacturer, not an Aldi “own brand”.

None of the Medion PCs that I’ve bought down the years came from Aldi – they came from a variety of other shops, including Sainsburys, Argos and Woolworths.

Its been a few years since I last bought a new Medion. When I did, I was always impressed to find they they came with a full set of optical disc recovery media, thus sparing me the long slow burning of backup media to DVD-ROM (or USB stick) that I’d have got with the likes of Acer, eMachines and HP.

That was my original point Derek that both Aldi and LIdl are of German origin and operate along the same lines here I did not mention “own brands ” but the fact they sold ( when I bought from them ) goods of their own countries origin not from China which might be the case now although I have not checked that out. I agree they provided more informational data than you would normally get now or even then thats why I bought them and until I dropped it the HDD had worked for many years recording all my sat box programs+films in a HDD hub .

Duncan,

My Medion akoya E1210 Notebook PC carries a Medion address in Essen, Germany but is clearly marked “Made in China”. I believe that model is simply a re-badged MSI-Wind.

My Medion akoya E5211 Notebook PC also carries a Medion address in Essen, Germany but, again, is clearly marked “Made in China”. I have a mechanically identical laptop that was sold as a Fujitsu-Siemens.

Those machines date from 7 or more years ago – but even then it was pretty much the case that almost all PC components like motherboards were made in China and a very high percentage of assembled PCs and Laptops were also made there.

Currently, the very best laptop I own is a business-grade Lenovo X201 – it is also marked “Made in China”.

That might be the case now Derek but I go back about 15 years and it looks now like Medion is outsourcing its products . I have found my old HDD and it says-made in Germany . Medion has a Manufacturing plant in Germany and in -2009 won the – -“Hardware Manufacturer of the Year award ” . I would be interested if you could find any info on China either buying Medion or investing in it , I cant at the moment. I have said several times on Which that when I speak of Land of Built to a Price I mean exactly that , most importers pay little for goods made in China because China has so many manufacturing plants and outsources its own products internally that you can buy at least three different versions of the same cased item as I did when I bought my first Chinese soldering station and found it was rubbish inside and dangerous . After intensive checking on the web I bought a “high class ” version -same external plastic case but much superior internals and yes it was double the price of the cheap one. I spent a lot of time checking out Chinese manufacturing including their laws on export which are pretty draconian in who is liable for faulty goods etc the Chinese government has very strict laws on it and controls all exports although you would not normally read this, I managed a long time ago to get onto a Chinese government website detailing its exporting of goods laws and regulations . Aldi have been in the UK for approx 27 years

Duncan, in your old HDD was the hard drive itself made by Medion – or by a major drive manufacturer?

In other news, during a visit to B&Q on Sunday , I was pleased to discover that the vast majority of wheelbarrows in their garden centre are made in the UK, by the Walsall Wheelbarrow Company.

I have a B&Q wheelbarrow and its very good, except the tyre keeps deflating. I can’t find any puncture, abrasion or other damage and have come to the conclusion that the tyrewall is not maintaining good contact all round the wheel rim so it lets the air out. It doesn’t take long to re-inflate the tyre and then it lasts for some time. Obviously, the amount of weight on the wheel will affect the deflation rate but I always stand the barrow upright on the frame when not in use with no pressure on the tyre.

As a wheelbarrow it is well-proportioned has the right balance, the right handle design, angle, length and spread, and a sturdy frame. The wheel runs well on its axle and when fully inflated copes well over rough ground as well as up and down low steps. It also corners well even if the load is a bit lop-sided. When tipping, the barrow goes up easily on its forward frame and enables you to turn it left and right for spreading the load.

Bets consumer analysis of wheelbarrows I have seen for a long time : )

It is one of those things where you sometimes suspect human height ought to be important in choosing the right one. I bought one with a solid tyre.

Reference special products, and I have no idea if this has bee planned for the UK or has happened but an Aldi special on kitchen sink tap is under special investigation in Oz for too much lead being added to water passing through it. Around 12,000 have beeen sold and presumably installed.

John – I suspect that your wheelbarrow tyre has a tube rather than being tubeless like a car. It’s easy to check by looking to see if the valve simply passes through a hole in the rim.

Thanks, Wavechange. That’s probably right. Perhaps the tyre inflation valve is defective and not shutting off fully in the closed position. I always give it a few more PSI than recommended when I re-inflate the tyre to allow for some leakage; maybe I have blown the valve.

I had similar problems, caused by rose thorns penetrating the casing and causing a leak in the inner tube. If you can get the inner tube out, inflate it in water to see where it leaks and use a cycle repair outfit. If you can’t extract it try a tyre sealant – worked with mine for quite a long time. Otherwise if it is a standard wheel, you can buy a complete one from Screwfix for about £14.