Banks make being a power of attorney arduous

I had managed my father’s current account online with A&L for 5 years under an EPA until Santander took over 6 months ago, when the account suddenly appeared as ‘Unavailable’. Since then I have phoned them 8-9 times, sent 2 messages online, written 2 letters (no reply) and visited Santander branches twice, all of which has achieved absolutely nothing. Everyone I have spoken to has told me the problem will be solved soon. This morning, in reply to the second letter, I received a phone call, I think from India, and I was told, for the first time in 6 months, that it was Santander’s policy not to allow online access for attorneys. I tried to question why I had not been told this before and to point out that it made no sense to accept me as a bona fide attorney and then make it impossible for me to manage the account in the most convenient way but he wouldn’t or couldn’t answer any questions. He then said that he would send me new login credentials. I am now totally confused. If I’m not allowed access why are they sending me a new login? It was probably a fobbing off tactic which is the only thing Santander employees seem to be good at.

I found the article in December’s Which? unhelpful. It told me what I already knew, that banks treat attorneys apallingly, but didn’t offer any solutions. I am a full-time carer. I can’t visit a branch or even an ATM whenever I want to so online banking is the only way I can properly manage my father’s account. So, is there a UK bank that understands the needs of attorneys and treats them like any other customer? You have been running a campaign to get people to vote with their feet to punish companies for bad service. Attorneys seemingly don’t have that option with bank accounts because no company gives good service.

I’ve had the most stressful time registering POA over my mother’s bank accounts. I think Barclays were the absolute worst. Even going through their official complaints channel twice didn’t resolve the issue. In the end the solicitor who drew up the documents for us in the first place had to speak to Barclays’ POA department and educate them. Eventually I had an apology and £200 compensation. I would gladly have paid them £200 and done without the time they’ve wasted never mind the stress. Not a much better story at Lloyds. I can’t face tackling Nat West and Nationwide. Why my mum has so many accounts all over the place I just don’t know.

I have experienced all the problems listed on this forum regarding an LPA given by my mother-in-law. I am currently pursuing the Nationwide who insist that an LPA can only be accepted by them if medical evidence of disability is provided. On prinicple I am refusing to provide this as this is not a requirement for an LPA to be registered with the OPG and subsequently used legally.

And then there was SAGA – an organisation supposedly interested in elderly people. They refused to register the LPA because I live in France. Again, the residence of the attorney is not a restriction on the legality of the LPA.

This whole business is exacerbated by the level of incompetence and lack of basic communication skills amongst banking staff – it is obviously a nightmare for many who are simply trying to help manage the affairs of vulnerable people. Do pursue and threaten these organisations – up to now I have obtained £800 in various compensations.

Unfortunately some people don’t have family they can appoint as Attorneys, or they are unsuitable to appoint (and given the abuse by Attorneys of those they are supposed to be looking after, family are not always the best choice) and in such cases they appoint a professional instead.

I am a solicitor dealing with this kind of work and can readily identify with many of the comments above and bank staff who quite simply have no understanding of the law and the differences concerning Ordinary (or General), Enduring and Lasting Powers of Attorney, and when they can and can’t be used, or having requirements which quite simply are beyond what the law provides for.

The inability of the banks to deal with matters efficiently can add considerably to the cost of dealing with someone’s affairs and whilst some are very good, others are appalling. I single out Santander as the worst I have come across who, for the same person, have required the registered LPA to be produced on three separate occasions, have required me to produce ID in the local branch, even though I am already a customer there, changed my personal bank records to tie them with my clients, and then said I had to submit a written request to change them back. They also required the attendance of my very badly disabled client to attend at the branch until I insisted that quite simply it was not going to happen.

Oh, and as I’m sure many of you will already know, trying to getthrough to the same person at Santander is impossible as nobody except a senior manager has a direct line and even when they leave a message to ring back you have to go through the tedium of the call centre to get back to the person you NEED to speak to because you already know that call centre staff CAN’T help you! Their inadequacies continue to the extent that 6 months after submitting a formal complaint, which was initially acknowledged, the complaints department have still not completed their investigation and have stopped responding to correspondence.

This all adds cost and complexity to what should have been a very straight forward matter, but unfortunately it is by no means my only experience of it. My firm tries to find cost effective solutions for clients, but it is extremely difficult when faced with problems like these.

However, the OPG’s office don’t escape criticism – it is currently taking around six months to get a registered LPA back from them after expiry of the statutory waiting period but guess what, they bank your cheque the day it arrives and you won’t get it back, even if the application hasn’t been acknowledged, in the event that the donor dies prior to registration completing.

Rebecca
Some banks are still stopping attorneys opening some accounts! I’m in dispute with Santander who flatly refuse to let me open any account for my mother. I have an enduring power of attorney for her but Santander say she has to sign their own form if the POA is not registered with the Court of Protection. My mother is in a nursing home, never leaves her room due to an anxiety state, is unable to sign anything due to an orthopaedic condition (she has to be fed and given drinks) but is mentally with it. I have told them I think they are being discriminatory. They want me to register the POA – I can’t because she is mentally capable. Advice from the Equalities Commission suggests my mother is being ‘indirectly discriminated against’ My complaint rumbles on…..we’ve suggested Santander should review their policy.

Nottingham Building Society will let a POA open any account except an ISA without the donors signature. We have suggested they read the HMRC rules for ISA Fund Managers – someone who is unable to sign does not have to!!!!

I tried to open a current account with HSBC for my mother with the POA. The account was opened and I was told I could use internet banking but was refused a debit card. I was informed that I would have to go into the bank to draw out cash for her shopping! They stood their ground and I voted with my feet, closed the account and use Nationwide & Nat West who both gave me debit cards.

I could go on with the problems with banks an POA’s. It is a shambles and someone needs to take it up at a high level and get it sorted. Being an attorney is a responsibility, it is generally due to stressful circumstances that are exacerbated by the unhelpful attitudes of bank staff.

Due to family circumstances I have had far too much experience with POA’s over the last few years. Few of the 22 financial institutions we have dealt with have got it right first time. Fortunately I have a husband who is a chartered accountant and we have known when to dig our heels in and shout, lots of people are given misinformation they accept as correct when it is not. In our experience, if as soon as a customer/prospective customer mentions that they hold a POA, they are transferred to the POA specialist team it might help. Instead it is often someone on a help desk who thinks they know the answer but frequently gets it wrong!

Well, it’s nice to know I’m not alone! My father lives in Scotland and I am 300 miles away. The banks constantly suggest I just ‘pop in’ to his branch, or get him to ‘pop in’. Another problem is that the Scottish banks are part of bigger banking groups – but very few of the general public know this. I was sent a username for online access by the Bank of Scotland, and a login was sent to my father (!!!) by the Halifax – for access to the same account – it took days for us to work this out. Similarly Royal Bank of Scotland letters constantly refer to ‘the NatWest account. All I want is online access to the accounts, but I constantly ‘fail security’ so I don’t get it. I have been ID’d so many times – and each time I have to travel quite a way or take time off work. I asked to be put through to the complaints department with RBS, and was told that because I’d failed security again I couldn’t be put through!

I posted on 8 August and since then have managed to get online access sorted by the Royal Bank of Scotland -this was after emailing the Chief Exec (twice!) and eventually a charming woman tried very hard to sort things out, and did largely manage to – though the online access continues to be a problem. I also managed to get online access to the Bank of Scotland only to discover today that because they had changed systems without advising me, all my online registration has to be done again. This has meant 3 visits today to a Halifax branch and still no resolution. I have made a formal complaint, but of course this might take up to 8 weeks to sort. I have emailed the Bank Of Scotland’s chief exec too – but I doubt anything will happen. All staff whether in branch or online are charming, but have no knowledge of the PoA system, and are completely unable to put me through to anyone who does, or who can actually progress things.

Dad and Mum had EPoAs drawn up years ago but never needed to make use of them. Dad died, and Mum became more frail and we faced the problem of how to get cash out of her account when she couldn’t get to an ATM. I didn’t want her to give her card to anyone else, so added the EPoA to NatWest and Nationwide. Each required forms to be filled in, and owing to the passage of time singe the EPoA was signed, I asked Mum to sign a short letter asking for it to be added to her accounts, which made each Bank much happier. I don’t know yet whether it has all gone through, but it seems to have been a waste of time.

Our intention was to transfer money from Mum’s account to my elder son’s. He could then use his own card to withdraw cash and hand it to her during his almost daily visit to Mum. No misuse of the card, money reaches his account before he withdraws cash, hunkey dorey. I’d have to do the transfer via internet as I live in France, but off we go.

I only needed Mum’s debit card details to set up internet banking for her with NatWest. I don ‘t know whether I should be logging in on her behalf, but she couldn’t do it herself, and as her attorney I feel perfectly entitled to do so. I haven’t tried to do anything with it yet so I may yet come unstuck.

Nationwide is a whole different problem. I can set up internet banking but not use it until a passcode is sent to Mum’s address through the post. I can pick it up when I next visit in a few weeks time, or son can open it for me and email through the details, but why the **** can’t they just mail it to me? Also, in order to do anything I need a card reader and her card. They won’t give me a card unless they take hers away first, and I don’t want to do that as she still uses it to shop by mail order.

I sent a secure message to Nationwide from my internet banking and asked how I can make payments from her account. They suggested removing the EPoA completely and instead being a second name on her accounts. I pointed out this might lead a future care-home to think I had been trying to reduce her assets and so avoid higher fees by claiming half her funds were mine, a long way from my intentions. I went on to ask just what I could do with the EPoA, and they replied with a link to an article on their web page explaining how to add it to an account……. I have just commented that this hadn’t really helped as I’d already done everything it suggested and could they please find someone who actually understood what I was asking.

Has anyone actually managed to perform any transactions via Nationwide under an EPoA? Without upsetting the aged parent or breaking any rules, that is!

All this to pay the window cleaner legally. Roll on a rechargeable card like an Oyster that can be handed to a representative who can use it only once to withdraw the cash and which is then useless until recharged by its owner.

Like other posters I fear for the future. When the baby-boomers like me are all getting frail and probably still helping out even older parents, we’ll all be working on IOUs because we have no access to cash, can’t hear the phone, can’t feel whether we’ve pressed the right buttons on the phone, can’t see whether the display says we’ve pressed the right buttons on the phone, can’t remember the password to log in online, can’t remember which phone number we gave the bank or what our memorable word was, and have to pay all our bills by direct debit, even Sainsburys and Tesco. Wake up Banks, or we’ll just be stuffing cash in the hems of our curtains.

Hi Dick
Thanks for your advice. I will be keeping the CEO posted, and will certainly threaten the Financial Ombudsman as this is an unresolved situation at the moment. To add insult to injury I have had a standard letter from customer services today, returning my POA application saying that because the POA is held jointly, they are unable to offer me: phonebank, internet banking, debit card!! Not signed by the lady who was so sincerely sorry etc etc., but by a computer. Just about sums up Halifax I think.